radical?

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  • #18951
    xdc the doc
    Participant

    http://www.taxpayersalliance.com/50bil.pdf

    What do peeps think about this?

    #74298
    XDC_Wolf
    Participant

    abolishing Building Schools for the Future? There are lots of areas that need money to develop them and the state of our schools is a prime concern. Alot of them are poor at best, but the procurement process is long and expensive. I was chatting to a lady who works as a consultant for consortiums bidding to build schools and she was saying that it costs each company £4 million to BID for a project, not even garunteed to get the contract, so there must be way over £4 million profit for each school that is built. Quite frankly I find that a little bit ridiculous, but apparently that is the way it is, and that cost must be absorbed somewhere. A streamlining of the schools building programme is a neccesity in the economic climate, but where do you priorotise? who gets to make the decisions on which schools don’e get rebuilt this time round?

    Hard questions and hard answers, interesting to read the report (albeit briefly) and nice to know that other people agree that public spending must be cut. Personally I reckon the could save all the money by cutting the wages of GPs by 10%, especially the ones that have the cushty jobs on the islands and highlands, where they moonlight as Vets for all the sheep they would otherwise be shagging…….

    #74299
    xdc the doc
    Participant

    Ha… one of the proposals was for a cut in wages for all public sector workers over 65k a year… which TBH I wouldn’t have a problem with. Since GP pay has been cut for 3 years running then it would be just more of the same anyway!

    r.e. building for schools… what a flipin haemorrhage of cash. All the builders colluded to put the prices of contracts up and the people making decisions didn’t have a clue.

    Privatise education I say. 😈 See if YOU get a job in the brave new world you work shy soap dodger.

    #74300
    XDC_Wolf
    Participant

    I have a job, and it is going well, albeit through a self employed basis. I have my own tuition business which is generating adequate income, and I only work a few hours a day. Most agreeable,

    #74301
    XDC-snell
    Participant

    @xdc the doc wrote:

    See if YOU get a job in the brave new world you work shy soap dodger.

    Are you talking to me ?

    #74302
    xdc magicker
    Participant

    I think those who drew up the proposals have forgotten that pumping public money into the economy had benefits beyond expensive schools. eg pay a builder to build a school and you not only get a school but he has a job and can spend that money in the economy.

    I have just finished our BSF procurement (i headed up the ICT side of things) and it was 18 months of hell. we had 3 bidders and they estimate the costs were about £1m for each of the biders. we are a small authority and in the 1st instance there are only 6 school and only 1 of which is a complete rebuild. the others are substantial rebuilds. will they make the 1m back over the 25 years of the contract?.. easily and it strikes me that for a 1 in 3 chance that is fair odds for the private sector. what was frightening were the legal costs we ran up as an authority.. they were shocking.

    the schools are not happy either.. they are locked into long term contracts that will be a squeeze for them to afford. having said that i cant think of any other way to guarantee that they will maintain the nice new shiny buildings. i cant believe the state schools have been allowed to fall into.

    in fact skimming down the list i cants see all that many things i would want to see the end of..

    stop the bloody government advertising, stop identity cards seem quite sensible.

    as for slimming down the LEA (ignoring for the moment that there is not such things as a local education authority.. a council is a council).. there are some areas that may be over staffed but in general there is no one left to get rid of. same goes for cutting non-front line staff in schools… that just means the front line staff will have to do the back end jobs.. and then there will be less front end staff. i think there is an argument for less teachers and more skilled non-teaching adults but that is a different matter.

    i have a better plan.. more tax for all the bastards who earn more money than me (to be kept in line with any future pay raises I may obtain of course)

    #74303
    xdc the doc
    Participant

    @XDC-snell wrote:

    @xdc the doc wrote:

    See if YOU get a job in the brave new world you work shy soap dodger.

    Are you talking to me ?

    I have no idea.

    Are you a work shy soap dodger? 😛

    #74304
    xdc the doc
    Participant

    I hear you Andy but the fundamental thing is… can you trust the government to do things well?

    Every time they spend money on some new crazy subsidy for some piece of crap that I don’t believe in or that would be better delivered by local communities it is MY money they are doing it with.

    If you cut back central government to just dealing with law and order, the military, a basic social safety net and possibly health care (this may sound self serving – but there are good reasons for making health care a special case) then we would probably be better off.

    I am perfectly serious about taking education out of the public sector by the way. It isn’t valued at present, has no reward for innovation or excelence in its staff and has failed miserably in its primary task over the last few decades.

    #74305
    xdc magicker
    Participant

    i know what you mean but things can improve and change drastically in a short space of time with the right leaders with the right balls.

    we have schools who have gone from 34% a-c to 85+ in less than 5 years… it can be done it just takes the right leaders to do it.

    as for private.. by definition this means that someone is profiting from the process and that just does not feel right to me. like you say.. some things are special and health and education are 2 of these things that people should not be making money on the back of.

    #74306
    xdc the doc
    Participant

    Its not making money from health care that would worry me – its the fact that with private business the emphasis is always on doing MORE. More tests, more drugs, more treatments. This is actually very bad medicine (I have seen it at work first hand in Auistralia and to a lesser extent NZ.

    The risks don’t apply in other areas of life – education included. Thats why i would single health out.

    Market forces in schools could do a number of things…. reduce waste… drive performance of teachers… increase the incentives of parents and children to do better and play a greater role (as they will be paying money for a service), create incentives to look after buildings, encourage innovation in types of schools and teaching techniques.

    You could still have universal education – just have a voucher system that can only be spent on school places and let the money flow to quality – with top up payments for the better schools.

    #74307
    xdc magicker
    Participant

    do you really think that existing private school give good value for money?

    what incentive would there be for school to take on pupils who suck? what about pupils with massive special needs? they would refuse to touch them and the end result would be no different to what you have now.. a large percentage of disengaged pupils only this time no one wants to try and help them.

    #74308
    xdc the doc
    Participant

    Well the answer to that is yes…. otherwise no one would go to them would they?? 🙂

    If there is money around to teach the difficult kids – they will get taught as well. It’s true however that there would be winners and losers in a market based system… but thats the point… there are winners and losers now… but we like to pretend that everyhting is rosy and pretend it isn’t happening.

    Just heard on the news tonight that between fraud and mistakes by HMG we lost 2.7 BILLION pounds last year in incorrect benefits payments.

    2.7 BILLION!!!!!! Thats my fucking money!!!!!!!!!! 👿 👿 👿

    Home

    #74309
    XDCiNSANE
    Participant

    err.. thats OUR fucking money!

    *shakes fist at this sometimes shite country*

    #74310
    XDC_Wolf
    Participant

    I agree with Doc on the citizens allowance, a surely much fairer way of running the benefits system. We all know it wo’t happen because the political will is not there. Shame because it could be a truly ground breaking development. As for Education, get it seperate from government, few people disagree with this that I have met, make an independent quango run education and decide on policy, then we might get some long term policies that are actually implemented for a decent amont of time and give teaches some stability and stop the eternal run of changes and the cyclical three year nature of education.

    #74311
    xdc the doc
    Participant

    Not quite what i had in mind Wolf = but there is merit in your solution too. I would certainly argue for a fully independent NHS in the way that you describe education.

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